This message was preached by Pastor Chuck Baldwin on Sunday, May 29, 2022, during the service at Liberty Fellowship.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship says that historical pre-millenialism/post-millenialism/amillenialism are all Jesus based, and that our differences are not worth fighting over.
He says that some historicists are childish, obstinate, argumentative and warlike; that they are a hindrance to the cause of Christ by the way that they attack and fight other good men due to minor differences of prophetic interpretation.
Some of his church members know about my reviews of his videos and may have shared them with him, so he may be pointing to me. If that’s the case, then show me how the language in my reviews has been childish, obstinate, argumentative and warlike?
Giving a validate explanation of the fulfillment of prophecy which exposes the fallacy of Chuck Baldwin’s preterist explanations is none of those things, for we are called to proclaim truth and expose false teachings.
Hypocritically, in this video, Pastor Baldwin childishly mocks futurists and historicists with his argumentative points, to get his audience to laugh.
As for ‘being a hindrance to the cause of Christ,’ it’s the very opposite, as showing the exacting fulfillment of most of the prophecies in Revelation during the last 1900 years proves the authority of the Bible and the deity of Messiah. It shows the glory of Messiah who foretold these events and has worked through His saints to counter the attacks of the enemy.
As for fighting other good men, you may be a good man in character, but if you’re giving false prophecy fulfillment explanations which mislead your audience, that won’t be deemed as good when you stand before your Righteous Judge to give an account. My rebuttals of Pastor Baldwin’s videos serve as a warning to him. If he would read the studies, watch the videos and read the book, he may see the truth, but he thinks that he already knows the truth and he remains obstinate.
There’s nothing MINOR about the differences between preterism and historicism, for they are completely different narratives when it comes to the fulfillment of Revelation.
Preterists proclaim that Emperor Nero was the antichrist. Historicists show how the office of the papacy, the Popes of Rome, fulfill Bible prophecy as the ‘little horn’ of Daniel 7, the ‘son of perdition’ of 2 Thessalonians 2, and the ‘beast’ of Revelation 13, who lead the harlot church of Rome. Those are huge differences!
Preterists proclaim that most of the prophecies in Revelation were fulfilled in the first century, and have nothing do to with the saints of the last 1,900 years. Historicists show how most of the prophecies in Revelation have been fulfilled during the last 1,900 years; and that they are about what the saints faced as Satan used the pagan Roman Emperors and antichrist beast Popes to make war against them. Those are huge differences!
Preterists don’t assign any Revelation prophecy to the apostate Roman Catholic Church. Historicists show how Revelation 17 describes the harlot papal church which is led by the antichrist beast Popes of Rome; which has misled billions of Catholics with a false gospel message of works through the sacraments and that Mary is the intercessor to the Father. Those are huge differences!
Preterists don’t assign any Revelation prophecy to the false religion of Islam which has deceived billions of people. Historicists show how Catholics helped write the Qur’an and prop up Mohammed as the leader of Islam in the sixth century during the fifth trumpet and they used Muslims to carry out attacks on Christians and Jews. Those are huge differences!
Preterists don’t assign any Revelation prophecy to what we see taking place today in the world. Historicists show how we’re in the sixth vial judgment, as the Ottoman Empire (Euphrates River) has dried up, the Khazar Jews (kings of the east) have taken control of Palestine, two world wars have reshaped the world and we’re waiting on WW III and a worldwide economic collapse to push the world into the One World Government. Those are huge differences!
Preterists have no end-times explanation for the mark of the beast, as they think that Nero was the antichrist. Historicists show how revering and obeying the antichrist beast Pope is the mark of the beast. When the worldwide economy collapses, people around the world will revere and obey the Pope as a uniting leader, to be able to buy and sell again, which has huge implications of having the mark of the beast! Those are huge differences!
Preterists assign the role of the false prophet to people who deceived Jews during the Jewish-Roman War of 66-70 AD. The two horns of the earth beast phase of the Roman beast kingdom (in Revelation 13), are the antichrist beast Pope and false prophet Jesuit Superior General, the white pope and the black pope. They pretend to be priests of Messiah (like a lamb) but serve Satan (the dragon) to make war with Messiah and His saints. Those are huge differences!
The bottom line is that Preterism serves to deflect blame away from the antichrist beast Pope and false prophet Jesuit Superior General, which is exactly why these false prophecy fulfillment explanations were created by the Jesuits.
Note: Pastor Chuck Baldwin doesn’t allow comments on his YouTube video, as he doesn’t allow others to counter his explanations. So posts like this serve as a public rebuttal of his explanations.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship says that the key that unlocks the door of understanding Revelation is when it was written.
Preterists have to make this case for their explanation to seem to fit the narrative, but there’s abundant proof that the prophecies in Revelation have been in the process of being fulfilled since it was written, so the timing of the writing of Revelation has no effect on the fulfillment of Revelation.
What unlocks the door of understanding is knowing how Messiah used symbolic language to point to a literal fulfillment. If you don’t understand the symbols which are defined primarily in the Old Testament, you won’t understand the fulfillment.
What unlocks the door of understanding is knowing how Messiah gave the narrative of four chronological layers which span from Messiah’s first advent until His return.
- Revelation 2-3 describe seven church eras, describing what they would face as Satan uses the Roman beast kingdom to fight against them physically and spiritually.
- Revelation 12-13 describes the Satan-empowered leaders of the Roman beast kingdom who fight against Messiah and His saints: the pagan Emperors > the antichrist beast Popes > the false prophet Jesuit Superior Generals.
- Revelation 17 which describes the antichrist beast Popes rise to power out of the fallen Roman Empire, who leads the harlot church of Rome, whose priests wears purple and scarlet, who use the golden cup during their blasphemous Eucharist ceremony, who have been drunk with the blood of tens of millions of saints during the Dark Ages and Inquisition.
- The seals, trumpets vials, little book of Revelation 10, the two witnesses of Revelation, the harvest of Revelation 14, etc., span from the first century until Messiah’s return.
When you overlap the four layers on a timeline, you notice how they interrelate and see the whole vision.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship cites Luke 21:20-21 and says that the abomination of desolation took place in 70 AD.
That is wrong, as the Roman legions of Vespasian and Titus surrounded Jerusalem before Nero died in June 68 AD, not in 70 AD. The saints had to escape before the civil war in Jerusalem, as the Jewish rebels were a greater threat than the Roman army.
Daniel 12:11 says that there’s 1290-days in between the abomination of desolation and the time that the temple sacrifice is taken away. Josephus documents that the temple sacrifices were stopped in 70 AD, so it’s not possible for the abomination of desolation to also take place in 70 AD.
The abomination of desolation took place when Cestius and his army surrounded Jerusalem in November 66 AD, to take Jerusalem captive. Then for no explained reason, Cestius and his army left, and when the Jewish rebels chased after them, it gave opportunity for the saints to flee to the mountains for safety before the Jewish-Roman War of 66-70 AD.
Then 1290 days later, the temple sacrifices were stopped when the Romans flooded into Jerusalem in 70 AD.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship says that the book of Revelation is John’s account of the Olivet Discourse.
There’s no way to apply the detailed description of the seals, trumpets, vials, little book of Revelation 10, the two witnesses of Revelation 11, etc.; to a fulfillment before 70 AD. Preterists tend to say that some of those prophecies are symbolic, so it will be interesting to see how Pastor Baldwin explains them in his upcoming videos in this series.
There’s ample proof in my Revelation Timeline Decoded video series and book, that most of the prophecies in Revelation have been fulfilled during the last 1,900 years; which invalidates Pastor Baldwin’s statement.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship says Luke 21:24 matches Revelation 11:2, saying that it’s about the Jewish temple.
Revelation 11 is not about a physical temple. The temple that’s being referred to is the Ekklesia of Messiah, His church, as He is the cornerstone, the disciples the foundation and the saints the stones which make up the walls. That’s the temple in which the Father dwells.
“Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief corner stone, in whom the whole building, being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord, in whom you also are being built together for a dwelling place of God in the Spirit.” Ephesians 2:19-22
The command in Revelation 11:1-2 was primarily fulfilled by Martin Luther, a Catholic monk, who was given the Scriptures and told to compare what the Popes teach against the rule of the Word.
What Luther found out is that the Roman Catholic Church is an apostate church and is not part of the true temple of God. They’re delegated to the outer court of gentiles. They look like they’re part of the temple, but they’re not.
While were on the topic, William Tyndale translated the Scriptures into English and Martin Luther translated them into German; and with the timely advent of the printing press, the little book of Revelation 10, the printed Bible was created.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship notes that Adam Clarke says that Revelation 1:7 is a presumptive proof that Revelation was written before 70 AD.
Adam Clarke said, All the tribes of the land. By this the Jewish people are most evidently intended, and therefore the whole verse may be understood as predicting the destruction of the Jews; and is a presumptive proof that the Apocalypse was written before the final overthrow of the Jewish state.
Though the Jewish nation was effectively desolated in 70 AD, another revolt took place in 132 AD. The misrule of Roman Judean governor Tinnius Rufus and Emperor Hadrian’s desire to establish a Roman colony on the site of Jerusalem, led to the final war, the Bar Kokhba Revolt. The Jews had some initial success, but Roman general Julius Severus overcame them.
After the defeat of Bar Kokhba (132–135 AD), Hadrian was determined to wipe out Judea’s identity and renamed it Syria Palaestina.
This event marked the final overthrow of the Jewish state, so we see that John’s statement in Revelation 1:7, and Adam Clarke’s commentary, can apply to this time. And we see that it doesn’t prove that Revelation was written before 70 AD.
This is a classic example of Pastor Baldwin cherry-picking information to be able to cite esteemed theologians, to make it seem like they’re validating his explanation.
But Adam Clarke doesn’t teach that Revelation is John’s version of the Olivet Discourse or that it’s about the desolation of Jerusalem, the temple and the Jewish nation!
In Revelation 13, Adam Clarke points to the Latin church of the antichrist beast Popes of Rome, as the enemy of Messiah and His saints. In Revelation 17, Adam Clarke again points to the harlot Roman Catholic Church as ‘Mystery, Babylon the Great.’
Adam Clarke says that the trumpet judgments are against the Roman Empire as army after army were sent to attack it during the 5th-15th centuries, culminating in the Turks attacking the eastern Roman Empire in the sixth trumpet judgment, leading to the fall of Constantinople.
Pastor Baldwin lacks integrity by citing Clarke when Adam teaches the opposite of Chuck about the fulfillment of Revelation!
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship says that the seven letters in Revelation 2-3 are to the seven existing churches in the first century.
Given that these seven churches are so close to each other, it makes no sense that they would experience dramatically different circumstances in the first century. Instead, Messiah is pointing to seven church eras which span from His first advent until His return.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship says that dispensational futurists teach that the seven churches of Revelation 2-3 are church ages. But most Christians today are futurists and they don’t proclaim these things.
I looked through several articles from DTS President John F Walwoord (whom Chuck cited) about Revelation 2-3, and I don’t see that he points to church ages lining up with the years 312, 590, 1500 or 1750. Walwoord may have said that, but DTS graduates do not teach it. Hal Lindsey, David Jeremiah, Chuck Swindoll, etc. don’t teach this concept, so Pastor Baldwin is creating a false association.
Pastor Baldwin mocks that the Smyrna church age ended in 312 AD; ‘not 311, not 313, 312.’ He asks ‘how do they come up with those dates?’
It’s pretty straight-forward when you understand history. The early church endured ten persecution periods from the Satan-empowered Roman Emperors. The worst one was the tenth which lasted ten years from 303-312 AD, as Diocletian sought to wipe out Messiah’s Ekklesia of saints.
This is the ‘ten days of tribulation’ that Messiah foretold that the church era of Smyrna would face, as one day points to one prophetic year. Revelation 2:10 says “Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.”
Revelation 12:11 points to the martyrs of the Roman Emperors winning the victory, “And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.”
The Smyrna martyrs also lines up with Messiah’s words in the fifth seal in Revelation 6:10-11, “And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.”
The name Smyrna is based on the word myrrh, which is a spice for burial. It symbolizes death. The blood of the Smyrna church era saints cried out for vengeance against the pagan Roman Empire for persecuting them.
Justice came during the trumpet judgments as army after army were sent against the Empire, which led the fall of the Western Roman Empire in 476 AD as part of the fourth trumpet judgment against the sun (the leader), when the Western Roman Emperor was removed from power. The Eastern Roman Empire fell in 1453 AD as part of the sixth trumpet judgment when the Turks conquered Constantinople by using large cannons (fire, smoke and brimstone) to knock down the thick protective walls. The fulfillment of these detailed prophecies invalidates the preterist explanation!
Pastor Chuck Baldwin mocks that the last church age of Laodicea goes on into infinity! What a childish statement! The last church era ends when Messiah returns.
Ironically, in Messiah’s letter to the end-times church era of Laodicea, He said “Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked.”
Pastor Baldwin thinks that he’s rich in understanding the fulfillment of Revelation, but he is blindly following (or purposely promoting) the teachings of the Jesuits of Rome who created the Preterist narrative to deflect blame away from the antichrist beast Popes.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship cites Revelation 1:1 ‘things which must shortly come to pass’ and Revelation 1:1 ‘the time is at hand’ to imply that the Preterist view is correct.
Those verses simply mean that the prophecies would begin to be fulfilled shortly after Revelation was written. We see how that’s the case, as the first seal points to the time of Emperor Trajan who conquered nations during his 98-117 AD reign, which was when the Empire was at it’s height of power.
Trajan used white horses and wore a laurel wreath crown in his military victory parades. He’s of the Nerva–Antonine dynasty (96–192) of Emperors who were not Roman, but were descendants of the Isle of Crete, who were famous bowmen. Messiah is pointing to the Emperors of Nerva by saying that they have a bow.
On this Roman coin, we see the Emperor with a crown, riding on a horse during a victory parade.
The red horse of the second seal represents a bloody time in the Roman Empire from 185-284 AD, as it went into a phase of revolution and civil war for 90 years, during which there were 32 emperors and 27 contenders for the throne.
The black horse of the third seal represents a period of gloom and despair, as the Romans suffered under excessive taxes that were needed to pay for wars. The pricing for wheat and barley point to food scarcity from 222-235 AD.
The pale horse of the fourth seal represents 1/4th of Romans dying from famine, plague, pestilence and violence, from 250-300 AD. The word ‘earth‘ is pointing to the Roman Empire as the ‘land’ of prophecy.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship says that the only interpretation that is devilish and harmful is Scofield futurism.
Though futurism is of the devil as it was created by the Society of Satan in Rome, the Jesuits; preterism is also from the Jesuits, as they created these two false narratives to deflect blame away from the Pope, as the Protestant Reformers all proclaimed that the office of the papacy, the Popes of Rome, fulfill Bible prophecy as the ‘little horn’ of Daniel 7, the ‘son of perdition’ of 2 Thessalonians 2, and the ‘beast’ of Revelation 13, who lead the harlot church of Rome.
Preterism is just as harmful as futurism, as it dismisses all that the saints face between Messiah’s first advent and His return. It leaves the saints without an understanding of the mark of the beast, and leaves them unprepared for Messiah’s return.
And Preterism serves to deflect blame away from the primary enemy of the saints and the whole world, the false prophet Jesuit Superior General who controls the world via three city-state corporations and many front organizations.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin preaches about Republicans versus Democrats, but that’s a charade, as both parties are filled with Catholics and people who have been trained by the Jesuits. They play different roles to use the U.S. to push the world into their One World Government.
Their evil plan is declared on the U.S. One Dollar Bill, which features a 13-step Freemasonry pyramid with the all-seeing eye of Satan above it, with Latin words which declare the New Order of the Ages. We see the Freemasonry numbers of 13, 32 and 33 on the reverse side of the great seal.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship says that historical premillenialists are preterists too.
He said that because historicists believe that much of Revelation has been fulfilled, this means that they are partial preterists.
That’s a nonsensical false association, as a preterist believes that most of the prophecies in Revelation were fulfilled in the first century. Historicists do not believe that!
Historicist prove out how the prophecies describe events that take place between Messiah’s first advent and His return.
Read Revelation Timeline
Or better yet, request the free PDF of the Revelation Timeline Decoded Summary on the home page of the website.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship says that Dallas Theological Seminary roots go back to Scofield.
It’s true that DTS co-founder Lewis Sperry Chafer was the protege of Cyrus Scofield, but Pastor Baldwin makes it seem like Scofield originated the futurist teachings. Once again, he’s deflecting blame away from the Jesuits of Rome who created futurism in the 16th century to counter the Reformation, to deflect blame away from the antichrist beast Pope.
Pastor Chuck Baldwin of Liberty Fellowship says that Revelation 17:10 proves that Revelation was written before 70 AD.
He says that the the Jews identified Emperors with kings, and says that five emperors had passed before John wrote Revelation. But there were only four emperors before Nero: Augustus, Tiberius, Caligula and Claudius; so Pastor Baldwin’s explanation invalidates itself.
He says Nero was the sixth emperor/king, which is not true as he was the fifth emperor of the Julio-Claudian dynasty (27 BC – AD 68).
He says that the seventh emperor lasted seven months, a short time, before Vespasian (the eighth) became emperor in 69 AD. But that’s misleading as there were three emperors between Nero and Vespasian, Galba, Otho, Vitellius; not one.
In Revelation 17:9-11, the eighth king is the primary character, who rose to power out of the previous seven. Pastor Baldwin says that Nero was the sixth king, which is not the focus, so his explanation and references are askew.
The Apostle John is pointing to seven forms of government of the Roman Empire. At the time that John wrote Revelation, five forms of the Roman kingdom had come and gone; 1) Kings, 2) Consuls, 3) Dictators, 4) Decemvirs, and 5) Military Tribunes.
The sixth form of the Roman government was the Imperial head, commencing with Octavian, better known as Augustus Caesar. This form of government existed in John’s day and was in power until the last emperor was removed in 476 A.D.
During the ‘short space‘ until the eighth king would arrive; the seventh head of the Roman beast was the Dukedom of Rome. Renowned historian Edward Gibbon tells us that Italy was divided unequally between the kingdom of the Lombards and the Exarchate of Ravenna.
Then the eighth king, the antichrist beast Popes of Rome were given civil and ecclesiastic authority in 538 AD. They ruled for 1260 years, until they were removed from power in 1798 AD during the fifth vial judgment on the seat of the antichrist beast Popes.
Revelation 17 clearly describes the harlot church of Rome, which carries out the Babylonian Mystery Religion with a veneer of the Scriptural faith, thus her name ‘Mystery, Babylon the Great.’ They’ve historically misled billions with a false gospel and they’ve made war with the saints, which is anti-Christ.
The bottom line of Pastor Church Baldwin’s teaching in this sermon is that the date of the writing of Revelation really doesn’t matter.
I prove out the historical fulfillment of most of the prophecies in Revelation during the last 1,900 years, which validate historicist explanations and invalidates the preterist explanation of Pastor Chuck Baldwin.
Messiah’s apocalyptic vision is a war manual, designed to hide the explanation from those who should not understand it. It uses symbolic words that are defined in the Old Testament to point to a literal fulfillment. If you read Revelation only from a literal perspective, the interpretation is hidden.
Understanding the vision is like taking a Biblical final exam. If you’ve read the whole Word, you will have seen the symbolism that Messiah uses and can apply it to the fulfillment.
If you read Revelation as one chronological narrative, the prophecies seem out of sequence. That’s because it has four chronological layers, each of which spans from when it was written until Messiah returns.
This book explains the prophecies of Revelation on a timeline to help you see how the four chronological layers interact with each other, so that you can comprehend the whole vision.
You will learn how to identify who fulfills the role of the son of perdition, the antichrist beast, the false prophet, and the harlot called ‘Mystery, Babylon the Great.’ You will understand the proper context of the seal, trumpet, and bowl judgments; the little book of Revelation 10, and the two witnesses of Revelation 11.
Whether you’re a novice at Bible prophecy or someone who has studied it extensively, I provide an explanation that is easy to understand yet has the depth of verse by verse explanations to provide you the evidence you need to prove it out.
Here’s a link to YouTube videos about the fulfillment of 2 Thessalonians 2 and Revelation.